Curse

I need my meds · Aug 21, 2005, 12:38 AM // 00:38

I dunno bout you, but how exactly are they horrible people...
Many religeons have killed their unbelievers, and plus, they were going basically against the leech.
Anyways, its not like the mursaat were going around the world trying to take over Ascalon and whatever~

Maybe the story is just too weak.

BTW, were the charr destroyed? If not, then what happened with the story...

Thanato · Aug 21, 2005, 12:41 AM // 00:41

actually they killed their believers (ie: the chosen)
and the non-believers in kryta ended up living poorer lives since those who believed were granted more freedom persay (lived in the cties, not on the outskirts, more food and wantnot) this is all from memory so pardon me if i'm wrong concerning anything

if ya want a good story, read a novel~ lol

as for the charr, i believe we ran away from them leaving ascalon to fend for themselves

Serpreme · Aug 21, 2005, 12:43 AM // 00:43

were brought up to believe that killing people for your religeon is bad. Its up to you to agree to it or not.

Theos · Aug 21, 2005, 12:47 AM // 00:47

Spoilers to those who have not done the game yet.

If you follow the story closely:
Start: War with Charr --> Flee to Kryta (due to overwhelming char and their "gods") --> Become mantle --> Become enemy of Mantle --> Discover and fight the Mursaat --> Discover Lich --> Discover Titans (if you look at them they are the Charr gods) --> Defeat Titans = Defeat of Char... or weakening of them.

If that was confusing do tell I will rephrase it.

As for the mantle, they are just fanatics, pawns of the Mursaat. The Mursaat are trying to keep the gods out of the world, making themselves gods. The White Mantle simply kill the chosen (those who would defeat the mantle and the mursaat) and keep the mursaat's hands clean. So like the Jades, the Mantle are simply pawns (well jades are more like enchanted armour). As you learn from Glint and the Seer the Mursaat are pretty nasty super humans (as they are by traits and desire pretty much the same).

Morganas · Aug 21, 2005, 02:30 AM // 02:30

Spoilers:

The mursaat were really just trying to protect the world from the titans. To do this, they had no choice but to kill the chosen and use the sacrifice to keep the gates of somethingorother closed.

It's doubtful the mursaat were doing this entirely out of self interest, as they aren't even native to Tyria, and could have fled should the titans have gotten out.

Given what information we know, that glint and the seer helped you, knowing that you would help the lich, makes them evil.

wolfy3455 · Aug 21, 2005, 02:35 AM // 02:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by I need my meds

I dunno bout you, but how exactly are they horrible people...
Many religeons have killed their unbelievers, and plus, they were going basically against the leech.

I agree. As long as we're fighting against leeches, we can do no wrong.

The mursaat were just another form of world conquerer. They were still evil, as if they had a hero complex they would dramatically sacrifice thereselves with much fanfare and tears from those their sacrificing themselves for in order to keep the portal closed. They would also use giant explosions to keep everyone interested and dramatic speech.

Tuna · Aug 21, 2005, 02:40 AM // 02:40

I side with good, but not entirely

. Killing people is never good but having titans roam the world doesn't sound too hot either. However, they probably weren't protecting the tyria for the good of its inhabitant but more for their own profit. Its hard to say how things would have turned out if they were succesful in protecting the portal.

conker · Aug 21, 2005, 02:46 AM // 02:46

if u guys think it dont make sense, they are makin expansions-not sorrows furnace+grenths footprints next year so yah maybe story will continue and clear up there

and i agree the story is dumb

Theos · Aug 21, 2005, 03:01 AM // 03:01

Evil, in the case with this story is very opinion based. The charr are not technically evil, they are the same as Ascalonians, fighting for land and survival. The Mantle are just idiotic puppets of a greater power, so you can't call them evil, simply misinformed. The Mursaat are world conquerors, as stated by the Seer. They destroy worlds and races. Glint is not good or evil, she simply guides you to what ends up being the destruction of the Lich, retrapping of the Titans, and from what I figure crippling of the Mursaat Forces and destruction of the White Mantle. So... it all works out.

I found the story to be nice actually, but hey I looked deeply into it

Leddy · Aug 21, 2005, 03:53 AM // 03:53

The gate you're looking for is called the "Door of Komalie".

I need my meds · Aug 21, 2005, 05:55 AM // 05:55

Right....glint isnt good or evil...she just makes sure the mursaat and the leach die, while reviving you when you try to kill her. Some crazy guide :P

Vermilion Okeanos · Aug 21, 2005, 06:15 AM // 06:15

Well.. it is more like a real world I guess, nothing is so clear cut... example: a man who steal to feed his love one due to extreme circumstances = good/bad?

The only thing people fight for are just different ways of doing the same thing, due to the problem of human nature of failure to approve other's difference.

uhh... almost sounds like I am preeching lol

Anyway... I have been wondering about mursaat and the seer... I mean, the seer look like bad guys honestly... for all you know, the seer probably work closely with the lich that have not been talk about in this chapter yet. And it was possible that it was either the seer or mursaat to drive the charr to attack the human kingdoms... and maybe Gwen will become some almighty being!! Forget the last part I just mentioned...

SJG · Aug 21, 2005, 08:54 AM // 08:54

It's very simple and very clear cut:
The White Mantle are bad because their leader is short - it's just not heroic;
The Shining Blade are good because their leaders are (supposed to be) attractive.

We are talking the action movie school of scriptwriting here, what else would it be?

Savio · Aug 21, 2005, 09:07 AM // 09:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by SJG

It's very simple and very clear cut:
The White Mantle are bad because their leader is short - it's just not heroic;
The Shining Blade are good because their leaders are (supposed to be) attractive.

We are talking the action movie school of scriptwriting here, what else would it be?

But the White Mantle have mainly male leaders, and the GW males have pretty terrible models. The Shining Blade have a bunch of female leaders, and the female models are pretty hot. (What do you mean, "supposed to be attractive?") So the White Mantle are screwed mainly because they have male leaders

Quote:

Anyway... I have been wondering about mursaat and the seer... I mean, the seer look like bad guys honestly... for all you know, the seer probably work closely with the lich that have not been talk about in this chapter yet. And it was possible that it was either the seer or mursaat to drive the charr to attack the human kingdoms...

The seer could have worked with the lich unknowingly, just like we all did. Just because the seer's ugly doesn't make him/her/it bad...the seer is the last of a race that fought against the Mursaat. Which still leaves open the possibility that the seer's race was evil too.

And the Charr...well, the Charr have always fought Ascalon. And Ascalon has always fought the Charr.

johnnylange · Aug 21, 2005, 09:14 AM // 09:14

What makes the story not good one is the simple fact that I don't have a star role in it.

Maybe in the next expansion pack...

Vermilion Okeanos · Aug 21, 2005, 09:26 AM // 09:26

The former adivsor of orr did look like a bad guy... and in the end, he was indeed a bad guy (I doubt him ever since first seeing him in BWE sanctum cay). While the seer... they even laugh and talk like a bad guy, it is as if the creator are preparing the character to be able to betray you any moment.

Now, the charr had always tried to invade the human kingdom... but they were saying that the human had been fighting among themselves in the guild wars while ignoring charr which allow them to have a large garrison... so that means charr had not been fighting with human all the time. Then all of sudden, charr nearly took down all 3 kingdoms out of no where... which previously they probably couldn't even do much, that was most likely why human disregard the charr until the last moment. I will bet charr had some helping hand from someone... While it is possible murssat found out about the oout side influence from the seer and which probably believe it would lead to the prophecy, hence they decided to use white mantle to prevent it... or at least prolong it...

anyway, thats how I see it... pure assumption...

heh, if seer cant take down murssat... yet we can, I guess thats no problem there lol

Weezer_Blue · Aug 21, 2005, 10:15 AM // 10:15

Get used to inconcistancies and circumstances equal to a horror movie where you're thinking "omfg what a dumbass... don't go in there!" (eg: giving a very powerful staff to a complete stranger who then procedes to raise the dead, and never aids you in your battle).

trelloskilos · Aug 21, 2005, 12:27 PM // 12:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weezer_Blue

Get used to inconcistancies and circumstances equal to a horror movie where you're thinking "omfg what a dumbass... don't go in there!" (eg: giving a very powerful staff to a complete stranger who then procedes to raise the dead, and never aids you in your battle).

.....and who sounds like Peter Lorre with a chest infection.

Starsky-sama · Aug 21, 2005, 12:33 PM // 12:33

well here's a suggestion.

why not somehow give the player the choice of interacting with two different stories. Even if it seems like the Mantles are the bad guys and the Blades are the good guys. It would be pretty awesome to have the ability to go in 2 diff storylines and let the player choose who they would like to follow. just a thought.

but again, it would "mess" GW current storyline atm.

*I would definitely choose the "Dark side" (Mantles) or take Ruriks place, if I had a choice ingame...hehe

/DaViziOwndEvry1.

Charcoal Ann · Aug 21, 2005, 12:52 PM // 12:52

i'm not sure that the Mursaat wanted the chosen killed because of saving Tyria.
In game it talks of a Prophecy that fortells the destruction of the Mursaat by the Chosen (and i think they presumed that they would release the titans) so they fixed both avenues by 1)killing the chosen
2)sacrificing the chosen on the bloodstones to keep the titans held
so from this i would say that the Mursaat are simply trying to save their own skins.

the mantle... they don't even know that killing the chosen will save them from titans, and they are simply unwitting pawns of the Mursaat.

Glint is the observer... supposed to stay distant from the proceedings. she simply makes sure that the requirements for her prophecy are met (ie that you go to help the dwarves).

the charr are bad guys, they worship the titans and they are the ultimate bad guys (along with the Lich) without the sceptre the titans would simply trash the entire continent anyway (probably including the charr

). they are not stupid (not that you need to be) you could think of the massive attack by the charr as like a lemming run (with massive axe wielding lemmings)

everyone else is simply pursuing thier own goal to the best of their abilities.

also the Vizier was obviously bad because the Lich says: 'the sceptre will be mine *again* soon enough.'
showing that he had once owned it, and it used to belong to Vizier Khilbron.....